I got my new Kiesel guitar today and found something I'm not happy with...

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AxRookie
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I got my new Kiesel guitar today and found something I'm not happy with...

Postby AxRookie » Sun Aug 25, 2019 4:43 am

Well after a little time with my new Kiesel guitar I've found something I'm not happy about.

On the Floyd Rose bridge and under the "A" string saddle I found a little piece of .004 shim stock which was only behind the saddle lockdown bolt so it wasn't supporting the saddle from front to back...

AND why was it necessary to make it and put it under one saddle?

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Last edited by AxRookie on Mon Aug 26, 2019 11:52 am, edited 1 time in total.

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texastoast
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Re: I got my new Kiesel guitar today and found something I'm not happy with...

Postby texastoast » Sun Aug 25, 2019 7:42 am

Floyds do not come in all radius configurations. It is usually put there to match the neck radius. Perfectly normal practice if done correctly. Weather or not that is proper i do not know.

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Re: I got my new Kiesel guitar today and found something I'm not happy with...

Postby AxRookie » Sun Aug 25, 2019 10:33 am

trying to raise one saddle .004 doesn't change the radius configuration and it is def a hand made shim...

I'd say it seems like a quick fix for something?

I measured the saddle height against it's counterpart on the other side using a digital caliper and they are both the same height?

I just bought a new $2,000.00 guitar and there should be no "quick fix" anywhere with it, Is that unreasonable to expect???

If there is a prob with the bridge they should have used a diff one or if there is a prob with the nut they should have used a diff nut OR a much scarier thought is there a prob with the neck???

It has to be one of those three things, So which one is it???
Last edited by AxRookie on Mon Aug 26, 2019 11:52 am, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: I got my new Kiesel guitar today and found something I'm not happy with...

Postby Naked Ape » Sun Aug 25, 2019 11:17 am

Kinda weird.....shouldn't be there.
Was there a set-up issue that made you discover this shim? Buzzing, or high action?
I would re-assemble without shim, and see if it sets-up to your liking without any issues.
If not....
I would call and ask them on Monday.

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Re: I got my new Kiesel guitar today and found something I'm not happy with...

Postby AxRookie » Sun Aug 25, 2019 11:22 am

Naked Ape wrote:Kinda weird.....shouldn't be there.
Was there a set-up issue that made you discover this shim? Buzzing, or high action?
I would re-assemble without shim, and see if it sets-up to your liking without any issues.
If not....
I would call and ask them on Monday.


No it shouldn't...

And if a shim was needed it should be a correct shim for the job which the shim used was not...

it is shimmed like the center illustration...

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Re: I got my new Kiesel guitar today and found something I'm not happy with...

Postby AxRookie » Sun Aug 25, 2019 4:51 pm

Yeah, I plan on calling them on Monday which I am dreading...

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Re: I got my new Kiesel guitar today and found something I'm not happy with...

Postby smoobg » Sun Aug 25, 2019 6:39 pm

Are you still within the 10 day return period? It would suck to have to do that, but at least you'd have that option. I hope you're able to get it worked out.
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Re: I got my new Kiesel guitar today and found something I'm not happy with...

Postby AxRookie » Sun Aug 25, 2019 9:17 pm

Another thing I found that was wrong was the shim for the saddle tension plate was between the tension plate and the base plate when it should be between the spring block and the tension plate to support the 6 fingers...

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Re: I got my new Kiesel guitar today and found something I'm not happy with...

Postby AxRookie » Sun Aug 25, 2019 9:41 pm

And now I see something else is wrong, I paid for the "drop shadow logo in silver" and I got plain white...

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Re: I got my new Kiesel guitar today and found something I'm not happy with...

Postby AxRookie » Sun Aug 25, 2019 11:13 pm

I wonder if they sent me the wrong guitar???

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Re: I got my new Kiesel guitar today and found something I'm not happy with...

Postby ioneater » Mon Aug 26, 2019 6:55 am

Out of curiosity, why did you disassemble the bridge?

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Re: I got my new Kiesel guitar today and found something I'm not happy with...

Postby ElfDude » Mon Aug 26, 2019 6:59 am

Sorry to hear about the hassles. :(

As suggested above, giving your guy at the factory a phone call is best.
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Re: I got my new Kiesel guitar today and found something I'm not happy with...

Postby AxRookie » Mon Aug 26, 2019 10:19 am

ioneater wrote:Out of curiosity, why did you disassemble the bridge?
To install my floyd rose tungsten sustain block...

I originally wanted to send it to them and have them use it instead of the stock block but they said they couldn't do that...

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Re: I got my new Kiesel guitar today and found something I'm not happy with...

Postby spudmunkey » Mon Aug 26, 2019 10:35 am

The existence of the shim doesn't surprise me. The manufacturing tolerances of the saddle blocks plus the electroplating, .0004 is nothing. That's about the diameter of a single red blood cell. Even if you meant .004, that wouldn't surprise me. To me, shims and Floyds go together like tires/wheels and wheel weights.

I'm not sure why a standard .005" Floyd shim wouldn't have worked or been used. That does seem odd.

Years ago, I remember reading something about someone putting the block shim above the base plate, but for the life of me, i can't remember why...but he had a reason. I don't actually know if Kiesel does this all the time, or even just ever...

The logo, though, is definitely a miss, and worth bringing to their attention. if the rest of the guitar is great, though, they might offer a (small) discount for you to keep it. Sometimes people fall in love with their happy little accidents. Just like my parents did. :lol:

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Re: I got my new Kiesel guitar today and found something I'm not happy with...

Postby AxRookie » Mon Aug 26, 2019 11:46 am

spudmunkey wrote:The existence of the shim doesn't surprise me. The manufacturing tolerances of the saddle blocks plus the electroplating, .0004 is nothing. That's about the diameter of a single red blood cell. Even if you meant .004, that wouldn't surprise me. To me, shims and Floyds go together like tires/wheels and wheel weights.

I'm not sure why a standard .005" Floyd shim wouldn't have worked or been used. That does seem odd.

Years ago, I remember reading something about someone putting the block shim above the base plate, but for the life of me, i can't remember why...but he had a reason. I don't actually know if Kiesel does this all the time, or even just ever...

The logo, though, is definitely a miss, and worth bringing to their attention. if the rest of the guitar is great, though, they might offer a (small) discount for you to keep it. Sometimes people fall in love with their happy little accidents. Just like my parents did. :lol:
Yes that is what I meant .004 (i corrected it) and it's not a big deal other than the correct shim should have been used if it was needed...

The last thing I want is to be the "difficult" guy but I don't like the all-white logo at all, That's why I paid for the drop shadow in silver...

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Re: I got my new Kiesel guitar today and found something I'm not happy with...

Postby kdawg » Tue Aug 27, 2019 8:01 am

AxRookie wrote:
spudmunkey wrote:
The last thing I want is to be the "difficult" guy but I don't like the all-white logo at all, That's why I paid for the drop shadow in silver...


If you don't like it, send it back and have them fix it. They'll do it on their dime (shipping). You paid for drop shadow, you should get drop shadow.

When it's all said and done, I'm sure you'll be very pleased with your new guitar.

BTW, you are not being difficult. You're being reasonable, and I'm sure they will be as well.

Good luck and let us know how it goes.

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Re: I got my new Kiesel guitar today and found something I'm not happy with...

Postby DannyB819 » Tue Aug 27, 2019 5:25 pm

I'd return it. A mistake like that will be annoying for as long as you have the guitar, and I'm speaking from experience. I had a (Carvin) guitar made that was supposed to have a flame maple headstock to match the flame maple top, and got plain maple instead. It's been nearly 9 nears since I got the guitar and it still annoys me that I didn't have it remedied. The main reason why I didn't do it was because it was an Option 50 neck profile that felt so good I doubted their ability to replicate it if they decided to make a whole new neck.

I ended up getting the guitar refinished by a third party last year to fix the factory mistake.

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Re: I got my new Kiesel guitar today and found something I'm not happy with...

Postby Koshchei » Tue Aug 27, 2019 7:45 pm

I doubt that Kiesel does anything to the bridges - it's probably from Schaller, who makes them. That being said, you could ask for an exchange (the bridge is modular), but I wouldn't count on the replacement not having a shim as well -- who knows what Schaller's internal processes are? I do know that Kiesel stopped using their 7 string bridges because the tolerances were poor and fit and finish wasn't spectacular.

As far as the logo goes, I'd just ask for your $30 back. It seems a little bit ridiculous to return the guitar and wait another 8-10 weeks for a replacement over an omission that you didn't even notice.

I'd also pay Danny no mind - he's the resident sour-grapes guy who hates everything Kiesel does because it isn't like it was back in the halcyon days of yore, when men were men and women were chattel.

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Re: I got my new Kiesel guitar today and found something I'm not happy with...

Postby HarlowTheFish » Tue Aug 27, 2019 8:55 pm

I'd agree with Koshchei here, the tolerances and quality on every Floyd-branded Floyd I've ever played (from the Special to the German) have all been . . . questionable. You mentioned in your other post that you wanted a low-profile trem, so I'd recommend swapping it out for the Edge Lo-Pro from Ibanez (made by Gotoh, the guys who make the best Floyd trem, and a drop-in replacement for the Floyd routing).
If you're really unhappy, call in and get a rebuild, but that seems (to me anyway) like killing a fly with a shotgun. I doubt the Floyd shim is a Kiesel addition, because they only do Floyds between 10" and 14" fretboard radius - either way you'd have more shims on all the outside strings or just on the inside ones, so this seems like a Schaller thing. I get the frustration with not getting what you ordered with the logo, but they'd give you the money back for it if you ask.

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Re: I got my new Kiesel guitar today and found something I'm not happy with...

Postby AxRookie » Tue Aug 27, 2019 9:46 pm

Koshchei wrote:I doubt that Kiesel does anything to the bridges - it's probably from Schaller, who makes them. That being said, you could ask for an exchange (the bridge is modular), but I wouldn't count on the replacement not having a shim as well -- who knows what Schaller's internal processes are? I do know that Kiesel stopped using their 7 string bridges because the tolerances were poor and fit and finish wasn't spectacular.

As far as the logo goes, I'd just ask for your $30 back. It seems a little bit ridiculous to return the guitar and wait another 8-10 weeks for a replacement over an omission that you didn't even notice.

I'd also pay Danny no mind - he's the resident sour-grapes guy who hates everything Kiesel does because it isn't like it was back in the halcyon days of yore, when men were men and women were chattel.
It's a genuine Floyd Rose bridge which I have already changed the factory sustain block to a factory Floyd Rose tungsten sustain block and I have a set of Graph Tech Floyd Rose String Saver Saddles and a set of the correct saddle shims coming here in two days, It will need the shims because GT saddles have a 20" radius and my guitar's fretboard has a 14" radius, I've talked with them today and they are sending me a prepaid FedEx return tag. I asked about the Floyd Rose upgrades I'm doing and if it will pose a prob and they said not at all...

As far as the logo goes, I did notice the first thing next day and if it takes 10 weeks for it to be the way I want it then it takes 10 weeks, I'll more than likely never buy a guitar of this high a caliber and cost again for a very long time if at all and I know what I want, I'm prepared to wait as long as it takes to get it...

And I let the danny thing go the next day and I was all about looking forward to the day I get the guitar that I always wanted!


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